Got a spat of reviews on Unoriginality
Feb. 26th, 2010 12:24 pm![[personal profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/silk/identity/user.png){kind=small}
farlaFri, Feb 26, 2010 01:07 AM
Story: Unoriginality 1: An Original Trainer Story
Chapter: 2. Mirror Unoriginality
From: Daniel 'Chiryu' Ernston ( http://www.fanfiction.net/u/1598741/ )
-------------------
B-b-b-but... the first chapter (at least if you keep it short) is something
like a standard. Sure it's not the most original thing in the world, but
really, I don't think anybody makes it drag on for more than one chapter. (At
least I know I don't. But I stick with the real regions.)
-------------------
Fri, Feb 26, 2010 01:16 AM
Chapter: 4. 3571
From: Daniel 'Chiryu' Ernston ( http://www.fanfiction.net/u/1598741/ )
-------------------
My personal reason is just because carrying more than six at a time is
impractical - hard to manage, that means. (As I quote, "you try managing seven
rowdy, hyperactive, and dangerous animals at once.")
-------------------
Fri, Feb 26, 2010 01:22 AM
Chapter: 7. Ha! You Can't Criticize Me Now!
From: Daniel 'Chiryu' Ernston ( http://www.fanfiction.net/u/1598741/ )
-------------------
Sometimes you just can't start when it gets interesting. You have to build it
up a bit, otherwise your readers will be confused. (But yeah, I sincerely hope
the type of Mary Sue you mention in this story isn't one of the common ones.)
As well, capitalize "Mary Sue". There's no excuse for that, unlike
"pokemon",
"pikachu", "dratini", etc.
-------------------
Fri, Feb 26, 2010 01:31 AM
Chapter: 8. Training and Losing
From: Daniel 'Chiryu' Ernston ( http://www.fanfiction.net/u/1598741/ )
-------------------
Some fanfiction throws canon straight out the window and still manages to be
good. (Of course, most of them aren't like that at all, but then again...)
Sometimes you can't always have reality in fiction. If fiction sticks too
close to reality, the result isn't very pleasing. I can tell that you're only
mocking the extreme cases, but the way you word them is as if any fiction that
stands one standard deviation away from your expectations is garbage.
You won't win anyone over by being so harsh. The only way you're winning
people over now is because of your examples, not the way in which you word
them.
Then again, if that's not your goal, I don't blame you
-------------------
Fri, Feb 26, 2010 01:34 AM
Chapter: 10. Pokemon School
From: Daniel 'Chiryu' Ernston ( http://www.fanfiction.net/u/1598741/ )
-------------------
Is this even a common problem? That is all.
-------------------
Fri, Feb 26, 2010 01:34 AM
Chapter: 11. Nicknames
From: Daniel 'Chiryu' Ernston ( http://www.fanfiction.net/u/1598741/ )
-------------------
When you're trying to pick a simple but meaningful name, there aren't many
choices. Of course, there's always the option of not nicknaming them at all,
but that would just lead to more confusion.
-------------------
Fri, Feb 26, 2010 01:36 AM
Chapter: 12. Heroics
From: Daniel 'Chiryu' Ernston ( http://www.fanfiction.net/u/1598741/ )
-------------------
The reason this happens is probably because not every story has to make sense
to that degree. Not even the canon follows this. Try taking it out on them.
-------------------
Fri, Feb 26, 2010 08:04 AM
Chapter: 14. Coniferous
From: Daniel 'Chiryu' Ernston ( http://www.fanfiction.net/u/1598741/ )
-------------------
Meh, I used Prof. Maple myself.
A thing about this one, though, you can't go judging the tree names as if
you're the authority on them. Perhaps they're all named after trees that
appear in the United States. Using big words like the genus and domain of the
trees will only serve further to make you look like a wordy snob.
-------------------
Anyway, when I got these I ended up pondering gender. I realize it probably doesn't seem profound to say I assumed the guy was male, so you'll just have to take my word for it that I didn't even realize their name was "Daniel" until after I clicked the link to their profile to see if they said they were male there.
(I suspect if I hung out on the regular "there are no girls on the internets" internet I'd pick up on anomalous female voices instead, but the fact I and the rest of us tend to cluster here in the first place is a good part of why there aren't any over there in the first place.)
I tend to be pretty suspicious of such intuition, since it's so incredibly easy to bias. But I mostly don't assign gender unless they're pinging as anomalously male, and when I do try to follow up they so far are. (Obviously this means that there are likely a good chunk of male writers contained in the main group. I just find it weird that when I do notice, I'm generally right.)
The other problem is that I'm not entirely sure what it is that I'm noticing most of the time. The three boys who popped up to bitch at me during NaRe I guessed to be male because that particular behavior seems to corrolate with fifteen year old boys in small groups, and even then I'm not entirely sure what it is that separates this from girls moving in groups. (Ironically, the only one who didn't instantly ping as male to me was Rocky - he only got the pronoun assigned when I went to reply to him directly and went by name. Unfortunately, since he immediately flipped to using female markers and elsewhere explained his little 'deary' temper tantrum as being because he figured I'd called him male for disagreeing, it's possible this was him trying to deliberately avoid the whatever-it-is that makes people ping as a particular gender online. In which case he's doing a lot better at it than I am.)
And when it comes to individual posts, when there isn't even group interaction to get clues from, I really don't know what it is I'm noticing at all.
What do you guys think?
EDIT FOR COMPLETENESS:
Fri, Feb 26, 2010 05:39 PM
Chapter: 26. Hypotheticals
From: Daniel 'Chiryu' Ernston ( http://www.fanfiction.net/u/1598741/ )
-------------------
And there's also the fact that in some stories, the trainers don't start out
at ten.
Not to mention, why are you exaggerating with how many times the 15-year-old
will lose? It's not as if they will lose every single battle for thirty
chapters straight. (Unless that is actually, literally what happens, in which
case, I sympathize with you.)
-------------------
Fri, Feb 26, 2010 06:12 PM
Chapter: 27. Another Opening
From: Daniel 'Chiryu' Ernston ( http://www.fanfiction.net/u/1598741/ )
-------------------
Why are the twenty chapters of training irrelevant? Why is it bad to have the
plot go pretty much alongside the training?
The reason they're called "trainer" fics is because there's training involved.
You can't just skip the training portion, then it stops being an OT story.
(And you can't just include them as "concentrated bursts". That's reserved for
stories that don't concentrate on the training.)
The key to making a good OT story is to have the training itself be
interesting, instead of having it as a mundane part of the journey that the
writer would rather skip.
And sometimes it's the unnecessary flourishes that give a story character.
There is no such thing as a necessary flourish. It's just a good thing not to
overdo it.
-------------------
Fri, Feb 26, 2010 06:22 PM
Chapter: 28. Regarding Ralts
From: Daniel 'Chiryu' Ernston ( http://www.fanfiction.net/u/1598741/ )
-------------------
I fail to understand why breaking canon is such an inexcusable, plaguelike
thing. Not every good fanfiction story follows canon to a T - in fact, I'm
pretty sure that some of the better stories out there actually do break canon
to some degree.
That isn't to say that you should just substitute your own ideas wherever you
want, but breaks in canon can go either way. It's just a statistic that most
stories that break canon are badly written - but correlation does not imply
causation. Most stories that follow canon are also badly written. What's your
point?
Is the Ralts thing really a common problem...? I haven't bumped into that many
Ralts fics here on FFnet. Nor do I go on the Serebii forums, so maybe that's
why you have such a beef with them.
About your final comment, Pokemon really are just balls of stats - that you
then work and shape into real characters. Just like any character in a story.
-------------------
Ugh. And I thought the first set was getting questionable.
Story: Unoriginality 1: An Original Trainer Story
Chapter: 2. Mirror Unoriginality
From: Daniel 'Chiryu' Ernston ( http://www.fanfiction.net/u/1598741/ )
-------------------
B-b-b-but... the first chapter (at least if you keep it short) is something
like a standard. Sure it's not the most original thing in the world, but
really, I don't think anybody makes it drag on for more than one chapter. (At
least I know I don't. But I stick with the real regions.)
-------------------
Fri, Feb 26, 2010 01:16 AM
Chapter: 4. 3571
From: Daniel 'Chiryu' Ernston ( http://www.fanfiction.net/u/1598741/ )
-------------------
My personal reason is just because carrying more than six at a time is
impractical - hard to manage, that means. (As I quote, "you try managing seven
rowdy, hyperactive, and dangerous animals at once.")
-------------------
Fri, Feb 26, 2010 01:22 AM
Chapter: 7. Ha! You Can't Criticize Me Now!
From: Daniel 'Chiryu' Ernston ( http://www.fanfiction.net/u/1598741/ )
-------------------
Sometimes you just can't start when it gets interesting. You have to build it
up a bit, otherwise your readers will be confused. (But yeah, I sincerely hope
the type of Mary Sue you mention in this story isn't one of the common ones.)
As well, capitalize "Mary Sue". There's no excuse for that, unlike
"pokemon",
"pikachu", "dratini", etc.
-------------------
Fri, Feb 26, 2010 01:31 AM
Chapter: 8. Training and Losing
From: Daniel 'Chiryu' Ernston ( http://www.fanfiction.net/u/1598741/ )
-------------------
Some fanfiction throws canon straight out the window and still manages to be
good. (Of course, most of them aren't like that at all, but then again...)
Sometimes you can't always have reality in fiction. If fiction sticks too
close to reality, the result isn't very pleasing. I can tell that you're only
mocking the extreme cases, but the way you word them is as if any fiction that
stands one standard deviation away from your expectations is garbage.
You won't win anyone over by being so harsh. The only way you're winning
people over now is because of your examples, not the way in which you word
them.
Then again, if that's not your goal, I don't blame you
-------------------
Fri, Feb 26, 2010 01:34 AM
Chapter: 10. Pokemon School
From: Daniel 'Chiryu' Ernston ( http://www.fanfiction.net/u/1598741/ )
-------------------
Is this even a common problem? That is all.
-------------------
Fri, Feb 26, 2010 01:34 AM
Chapter: 11. Nicknames
From: Daniel 'Chiryu' Ernston ( http://www.fanfiction.net/u/1598741/ )
-------------------
When you're trying to pick a simple but meaningful name, there aren't many
choices. Of course, there's always the option of not nicknaming them at all,
but that would just lead to more confusion.
-------------------
Fri, Feb 26, 2010 01:36 AM
Chapter: 12. Heroics
From: Daniel 'Chiryu' Ernston ( http://www.fanfiction.net/u/1598741/ )
-------------------
The reason this happens is probably because not every story has to make sense
to that degree. Not even the canon follows this. Try taking it out on them.
-------------------
Fri, Feb 26, 2010 08:04 AM
Chapter: 14. Coniferous
From: Daniel 'Chiryu' Ernston ( http://www.fanfiction.net/u/1598741/ )
-------------------
Meh, I used Prof. Maple myself.
A thing about this one, though, you can't go judging the tree names as if
you're the authority on them. Perhaps they're all named after trees that
appear in the United States. Using big words like the genus and domain of the
trees will only serve further to make you look like a wordy snob.
-------------------
Anyway, when I got these I ended up pondering gender. I realize it probably doesn't seem profound to say I assumed the guy was male, so you'll just have to take my word for it that I didn't even realize their name was "Daniel" until after I clicked the link to their profile to see if they said they were male there.
(I suspect if I hung out on the regular "there are no girls on the internets" internet I'd pick up on anomalous female voices instead, but the fact I and the rest of us tend to cluster here in the first place is a good part of why there aren't any over there in the first place.)
I tend to be pretty suspicious of such intuition, since it's so incredibly easy to bias. But I mostly don't assign gender unless they're pinging as anomalously male, and when I do try to follow up they so far are. (Obviously this means that there are likely a good chunk of male writers contained in the main group. I just find it weird that when I do notice, I'm generally right.)
The other problem is that I'm not entirely sure what it is that I'm noticing most of the time. The three boys who popped up to bitch at me during NaRe I guessed to be male because that particular behavior seems to corrolate with fifteen year old boys in small groups, and even then I'm not entirely sure what it is that separates this from girls moving in groups. (Ironically, the only one who didn't instantly ping as male to me was Rocky - he only got the pronoun assigned when I went to reply to him directly and went by name. Unfortunately, since he immediately flipped to using female markers and elsewhere explained his little 'deary' temper tantrum as being because he figured I'd called him male for disagreeing, it's possible this was him trying to deliberately avoid the whatever-it-is that makes people ping as a particular gender online. In which case he's doing a lot better at it than I am.)
And when it comes to individual posts, when there isn't even group interaction to get clues from, I really don't know what it is I'm noticing at all.
What do you guys think?
EDIT FOR COMPLETENESS:
Fri, Feb 26, 2010 05:39 PM
Chapter: 26. Hypotheticals
From: Daniel 'Chiryu' Ernston ( http://www.fanfiction.net/u/1598741/ )
-------------------
And there's also the fact that in some stories, the trainers don't start out
at ten.
Not to mention, why are you exaggerating with how many times the 15-year-old
will lose? It's not as if they will lose every single battle for thirty
chapters straight. (Unless that is actually, literally what happens, in which
case, I sympathize with you.)
-------------------
Fri, Feb 26, 2010 06:12 PM
Chapter: 27. Another Opening
From: Daniel 'Chiryu' Ernston ( http://www.fanfiction.net/u/1598741/ )
-------------------
Why are the twenty chapters of training irrelevant? Why is it bad to have the
plot go pretty much alongside the training?
The reason they're called "trainer" fics is because there's training involved.
You can't just skip the training portion, then it stops being an OT story.
(And you can't just include them as "concentrated bursts". That's reserved for
stories that don't concentrate on the training.)
The key to making a good OT story is to have the training itself be
interesting, instead of having it as a mundane part of the journey that the
writer would rather skip.
And sometimes it's the unnecessary flourishes that give a story character.
There is no such thing as a necessary flourish. It's just a good thing not to
overdo it.
-------------------
Fri, Feb 26, 2010 06:22 PM
Chapter: 28. Regarding Ralts
From: Daniel 'Chiryu' Ernston ( http://www.fanfiction.net/u/1598741/ )
-------------------
I fail to understand why breaking canon is such an inexcusable, plaguelike
thing. Not every good fanfiction story follows canon to a T - in fact, I'm
pretty sure that some of the better stories out there actually do break canon
to some degree.
That isn't to say that you should just substitute your own ideas wherever you
want, but breaks in canon can go either way. It's just a statistic that most
stories that break canon are badly written - but correlation does not imply
causation. Most stories that follow canon are also badly written. What's your
point?
Is the Ralts thing really a common problem...? I haven't bumped into that many
Ralts fics here on FFnet. Nor do I go on the Serebii forums, so maybe that's
why you have such a beef with them.
About your final comment, Pokemon really are just balls of stats - that you
then work and shape into real characters. Just like any character in a story.
-------------------
Ugh. And I thought the first set was getting questionable.
![[identity profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/silk/identity/openid.png){kind=small}
no subject
Date: 2010-03-09 05:10 am (UTC)You're new to the fandom. That's fine. You're reading a story that's a list of things that are problems in this fandom, which you are new to. Your immediate response is to argue that half of them aren't a big deal while guessing I made the other half up.
Just going out on a limb here: Possibly you have no idea what you're talking about, and therefore, you lecturing me that I'm doing it wrong is going to be taken badly.
no subject
Date: 2010-03-09 01:04 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 2010-03-09 03:08 pm (UTC)